Quiting school for an appenticeship.

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Well I've had it. I'm semi-officially throwing in the towel on the management degree for now. The program doesn't focus on skill development. They would rather waste what little time we have doing functions instead. I'm looking at becoming an apprentice instead. I learn best in a hands on enviroment and I think that this wouls be for the best. I will finish the management degree. I believe that it is important for my overall development.

Any thing I should look for when looking at the places that do the apprenticeship thing. I'm leaning toward The Brown Palace because they do nearly everything in house and you are run through everything there befor you complete the program.

The good news is that our bake shop chef instuctor ain't gonna play the game with them and well will get to focus on learning the basics of baking. Chef Winters seems to be a good guy and I'm looking forward to the class.

By Chefmanny (Chefmanny) on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 12:21 pm: Edit

Go to the best places in town!

By Flattop (Flattop) on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 01:22 pm: Edit

I will! I will!

I am also going to see if there is anyway to improve the program before I leave it. I may only look a kitchen that would be able to teach me the culinary skills while getting the business education where I'm at.

I'm staying at least until the end of the semester because it looks like the bake shop class will be fun and the home work in Beers and spririts is to my liking.

This gives me some time to look over my options and make a decision before next fall.

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 08:02 pm: Edit

home work in beer and spririts????????
sign Manny and me up!!!!!!!!!
maybe we can stay with you?
I call couch!

By Flattop (Flattop) on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 09:34 pm: Edit

You'd have to sleep with the dog then.

We even get to brew our own beer!!

By Chefmanny (Chefmanny) on Sunday, January 26, 2003 - 07:19 am: Edit

Remember, you sleep with dogs, they might get pregnant!!!
Don't forget your rubber............gloves, that is.
The main thing about that class is to not get it scheduled at 7:30AM, I had it at that time and the rest of the day just did not go as well as that first class!!!

By Chefrev (Chefrev) on Sunday, January 26, 2003 - 06:16 pm: Edit

Man! I knew I missed something by not going to culinary school! So what's pub crawling considered in that class? Independent study?

Seriously, Flattop, hope your apprentice thing works out. Stay focussed and you'll find the experience and training you'll need.

By Flattop (Flattop) on Sunday, January 26, 2003 - 08:42 pm: Edit

I was tring to get credit for life experiance..

I plan on it Chefrev, I've been wanting to do this for too long to give up on it now. One way or another I will get the education I'm looking for and the skills too succeed. I'll be contacting the ACF rep regarding the apprenticeship soon to find out who I can do it with.

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Saturday, February 01, 2003 - 01:35 am: Edit

I'm sleeping with a dog now....just not in the same room.
beer and knives, now there's a combination.
is there nap time after class?

By Corey (Corey) on Saturday, February 01, 2003 - 11:44 am: Edit

hey, whats my ex doing there?

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Saturday, February 01, 2003 - 05:55 pm: Edit

I don't know, but man you should see her sister!

By Flattop (Flattop) on Sunday, February 02, 2003 - 06:31 pm: Edit

I've recieved a list of the "approved" places for me to look for an apprenticeship. The list is mostly 4star hotels or country clubs with only a few restaurants. I plan of speaking with as many of the chefs as possible to find the right match for me. I want to know what to expect when asking a chef questions about his operation and what will be expected of me. I want what I'll give, honest answers. I want to know what to expect from them. And I want to know what is expected of me. Those questions I know how to ask. What else should I be looking for.

By Steve9389 (Steve9389) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 09:57 am: Edit

I've been asking similar questions as I plan where to extern this summer. The advice I keep getting is to go to a really good hotel. You get the culinary experience, and because of the banquet work you also get good experience at volume as well. To that end, I'm leaning toward a restaurant near my house that has a very busy 400-seat banquet hall (no good hotels nearby).

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 06:48 pm: Edit

"And I want to know what is expected of me"...........Why everything of course!
Hey Flattop, just go kick some ass!!!
Buy the sound of it your not stupid, you love to learn, and you do things on your own. THAT is exactly what Chef's look for, all you have to do is show up, get dressed and keep your eyes and ears open.....and before you know it, they will be talking about this guy and the great bread he makes!!
LOL!!!!

By Flattop (Flattop) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 08:03 pm: Edit

That would be sweet. Feed the bitch! Ahhh.. I could live with that. Got to admit that I'm having more fun than the chef who is taking the class is. I don't think he likes being so precise.

Yeah I'm stupid or I would have done this a long time ago. Live and learn. It's nice to be able to get the encouragement that we get here. It does help keep me focused.

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 08:38 pm: Edit

feed the what?

By Chefmanny (Chefmanny) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 08:50 pm: Edit

You want to ask if they are going to use you as an apprentice or as a gopher/dishwasher/potato peeler/get the chef a drink/put away delivery/get donuts/getcoffee kind of guy......oh wait that is an apprentice!!!!
No really, don't take any BS, if you are beign abused and you are NOT learning, leave!
Many apprentices are used as mules, some abuse is natural as long as you are beign educated in the mean time!
Good Luck

By Flattop (Flattop) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 09:33 pm: Edit

Sorry that was a Kitchen Confidential refernce. One of the "charactors" called his starter the bitch. and supposedly made greay bread.

I expect to some abuse, hell it is the kitchen, but I if I'm not learning I'll walk for sure. I will interview evey chef on my list to find the right place to go you can bet on that.

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 09:44 pm: Edit

come on, whats abuse??
if you don't get hit and the chef does not throw pots and pans.......your fine.
just don't stab anyone.
i made that mistake, the job was never the same after that.
good luck.

By Flattop (Flattop) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 10:05 pm: Edit

Ummm.. was it accidental? Speaking of knives, what type of knives should I have in my knive bag besides a chefs, a utility and a paring? We're not required to buy them for the program that I'm in. I waiting for somebody to cut themself good with some of the crap knives that are being used by some of the students. Right now I'm using the Chef's Direct knives. They're not bad, hold a edge well, finish could be better but good enough for school and home use. I'll be looking into a better set for the appernticeship.

By Chefrev (Chefrev) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 10:59 pm: Edit

Geez, where ARE you? Bob's School of Culinary Arts? NO KNIVES REQUIRED!? LOL! Wait, wait! No offense intended! I was just surprised by your last post! A chef's knives are an extension of his/her self. A good knife can feel like part of your hand if it's sharp and well balanced.

I like Forschner (sp?), or Henckels but any high-carbon stainless steel bladed knife will do. You'd probably need a good long chef knife (at least 12"), a long, offset, serrated bread knife (good for cutting chocolate off blocks too), a slicer, a boning knife, and my personal favorite, a scimitar (long, curved slicer, great for cutting steaks).

By Flattop (Flattop) on Monday, February 03, 2003 - 11:47 pm: Edit

Trust me I understand why do you think I'm going to the apprenticeship.

We are not required to buy knifes for the degree program. This is because the majority of the students are in restaurant management and or hotel management rather then culinary management. We have to have knives but we are not made to buy them. Just bring what you got from home. As it is My knives tend to be used by those with the ginsus and other crap knives. Most of the students can't even use the tri stones. They just grind away on the autosharpener.

By Steve9389 (Steve9389) on Tuesday, February 04, 2003 - 09:22 am: Edit

Manny's point about making sure they actually let you do useful stuff is a good one. I've got a friend who just started an externship at onesixtyblue, Chicago's hottest new place, co-owned by Michael Jordan. First day, the chef put him on hot apps, right into the fires of hell, and now in the second week he's working garde manger by himself. He's already gone from being good to being very good, well on his way to being killer.

I thought it was especially interesting that for all the grousing we do that we don't get enough production experience, he felt that our school totally prepared him to step behind the line and not f*** up or singe off his eyebrows. That made me feel good.

By Esjay (Esjay) on Tuesday, February 04, 2003 - 09:39 am: Edit

"Give me strength"........ what's happening to the next genaration of chef's..... would you go to a barber who brings his scissors from home?
a mechanic who uses domestic tools.........
Spend the money on decent knives,(sell them to the next group)and they will last longer than you.
Decent knives? FDick, Salinger, Sabatour,Giesser,(European, hard stainless steel) use a stone & steel to sharpen them, grinders do just that! grind the steel from the blade. There are "cheaper" knives around, avoid anything from Japan, the steel is to soft, they lose the edge, amd wear down very quickly.

By Flattop (Flattop) on Tuesday, February 04, 2003 - 02:24 pm: Edit

My knives are "Good" knives. They are Solingen made and Ice tempered stainless steel. I've compared them to Henkels and Wustofs and I think they are for the amount I spent a better value and an nearly equal quaility. I've been using a stone and steel for most of my life. I actually like them. Knives I know, which knive to use for what is I need to learn

By Chefspike (Chefspike) on Wednesday, February 05, 2003 - 11:01 pm: Edit

a meat knife
a boning knife
a bread knife
a straight paring
a curved paring
a big french
a small french
a medium french
and a partridge in a pear tree...............

By Flattop (Flattop) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 02:00 am: Edit

Okay now how about a baking and pastry kit?

Is a 8" a med french?

By Ladycake (Ladycake) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 11:08 am: Edit

I wouldn't take my pastry kit into anybody else's kitchen, ever. Any reasonable kitchen has a few items and if you take yours in, you'll never see them again!

And watch your knives. One of the sous chefs at the Marriott told me that he liked marked knives because it helped him remember where he got them from.

By Chefmanny (Chefmanny) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 12:28 pm: Edit

SPike, Spike, Spike, what the hell is a meat knife? (Butcher knife pastry boy)
Please stick to Pastry advice!!!! (Just messing with you!)
A good knife is like beauty, it's in the hand of the holder....of the knife that is! (eye of the beholder for the beauty thing)
I have always liked Victorinox/Forschner, I always disliked Henkels, I thought they were to hard to keep sharp, other people love them.
Some people like a heavy knife, some light; to me it depends what I'm doing! If the task is short and fast I like a heavy knife, if it's long and drawn out, I like a light knife!
Those knives with the fancy stainless steel handle with holes are pretty but a sanitary nightmare and, EXPENSIVE!
Chinese cleaver is also very, very, handy!!!

By Corey (Corey) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 01:28 pm: Edit

I always get nervous when I have to get a new knife and the sales person is a girl. Why?
You try asking a girl if she can give you a stiff 8in boner.

By Steve9389 (Steve9389) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 01:55 pm: Edit

HA! I had one teacher who swears by Dick knives. His line: "Everyone should have a 10-inch Dick."

By Corey (Corey) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 02:04 pm: Edit

ha!

By Chefrev (Chefrev) on Thursday, February 06, 2003 - 10:30 pm: Edit

GROAN! When I said a chef's knife is an extension of himself that's not QUITE what I had in mind....

By Steve9389 (Steve9389) on Friday, February 07, 2003 - 12:06 am: Edit

Yeah, Chefrev. That would make dates a little dicey, too. (ooh, sorry)

By Corey (Corey) on Friday, February 07, 2003 - 02:14 am: Edit

wow, if you can get it stiff enoght to chop things
you have more problems than you might think...